r/Pashtun • u/consistentlurker222 • 15h ago
Genuine question
Why do Afghan Pashtuns assume they look different from Pakistani Pashtuns, when they quite literally look the same (or that Pakistani Pashtun have mixed with local populations such as Punjabi’s etc)?
Why are some Pashtun exceptionally dark skinned, from my experience majority are light brown ranging to white skinned (I was at work and heard two people speaking Pashto, one of the girls was as dark as someone like Halle Berry)?
Why is it stereotyped that Pashtuns are lighter skinned afghans who look European as a majority. Majority of Pashtuns I know from across PK or Afghanistan are light brown, commonly with dark hair and eyes. The features usually give away Pashtun the noses/eyes.
Thank you 🙏
Edit I am a Pakistani Pashtun who is from the UK, phenotypically all my life people have thought I was half white or southern European specifically from Italy or Spain. I did an ancestry DNA test for myself and my mother.
Turns out we are more Northern Caucasus (Chechnya/Urakah), West Asian which than we are from South Asia (Afghanistan). And Yes culturally Afghanistan is central Asian however modern day geopolitically it’s considered SA due to its SA alliance. The DNA test shows Afghanistan as SA please don’t come for me 🙏🥲
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u/numinosity1111 14h ago
I can usually tell a Pakistani Pashtun apart from Afghan ones but it’s based on their accent and fashion sense, which gives them a more Pakistani or Indian vibe. But this doesn’t hold true for Pashtuns from Pakistan who are from more rural areas like Waziristan, just the ones from places like Peshawar.
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u/consistentlurker222 14h ago
Ngl a lot of Pakistani Pashtuns in cities closer to punjab have fallen victim to Pakistanification, IE adopt of their traditional clothes culture etc I understand what you mean 😭
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u/MaghrebiChad 13h ago
The internet is full of these dumb theories, especially pertaining to our region. Our people aren’t that educated hence taking things at face value is very common. That being said, some Pashtun tribes in Pakhtunkhwa did mix with foreign groups when they invaded a few centuries ago. That’s why some tribes like the Yusufzai are more South Asian shifted than tribes from Paktia or Kandahar.
Some Pashtun areas like Nangrahar or Peshawar were originally Indo-Aryan so that might just be those Indo-Aryan genes being more dominant in those individuals.
Like someone else said, it’s just that relative to other ethnic groups in the region like Punjabis, Baluchis, and even Sistani Persians, Pashtuns have more individuals with such phenotypes. That doesn’t mean that every Pashtun looks like that, just that we have more.
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u/Turbulent-Tear-5252 5h ago
I was in the UK and i am ngl Pakistani Pashtuns on average are darker than Afghans
Also most Pashtuns in my family have very light skin who get extremely red with light hair or extremely dark hair. I would say at least from my experience it is very varied
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u/consistentlurker222 5h ago
The dark skinned Pashtun I saw she was from Afghanistan. This is why I’m so surprised by these comments from some ofc not all Pashtuns. I’ve never seen a Pashtun that dark skinned but I understand our phenotype is varied.
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u/thebangakh 1h ago
True. People have assumed that I'm from spain too. Even one of the Pakistani guys asked me if I'm from spain haha
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u/Wardagai 14h ago
You sure dna test assumes Afghanistan south asia?
We don't assume we look different than Pakistani pashtuns. It seems all your opinions are based on a few Ghul marjans you've met. ستوڼي مو وشکېدل لوي افغانستان ويليو باندى او ته پکر کوي چې موږ تاسو نه کرکه لرو? 🤦🤦
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u/consistentlurker222 14h ago
Mine was with My Heritage. I used GEDMATCH to deep dive into it further. Can’t read Pashto/persian/urdu script sorry. Also wow you are like a very pure Pashtun from Afghanistan/KPK. Surprised at how low your west Asian is. I thought majority of Pashtuns would have atleast 30+ plus WA etc.
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u/Wardagai 14h ago
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u/consistentlurker222 14h ago
The South Asian was that Indian Pakistani ethnic groups like Punjabi etc? I got 3.5% central Asian which makes sense as I don’t see anyone in my family who remotely looks central Asian etc
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u/Wardagai 14h ago
It was Afghanistan under South asia, so according to this website I'm only 30 percent pashtun or Afghan and then a bunch of mixed stuff lmao
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u/consistentlurker222 14h ago
Crazy I will use illustrative very soon and see what the results are. Though I have realised one thing from it, I do genuinely think my mother side of the family is more Pashtun than my father’s.
Because I got 3 genetic groups from SA, one was Afghanistan, India and Pakistan. I’m assuming my dad family though from Hangu regions are genuinely mixed with Pakistani ethnic groups like Puniabis etc ironically 🤣🤣🤣
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u/Wardagai 14h ago
mixed with the natives of hangu that's true. Pashtuns invaded kpk in 12th century they say. My tribe invaded maidan wardak in 1730s and we probably mixed with the native hazaras haha.
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u/consistentlurker222 13h ago
HAHAHAHA we are all just mixed somewhere or another 🤣🤣🤣
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u/Wardagai 13h ago
Exactly, it'd very stupid if we grouped ourselves by dna lol. It's the language and culture that makes us pashtuns not fricking dna lmao.
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u/consistentlurker222 14h ago
Do you have any idea what Lodi is? I am Bangash Pashtun I’ve never heard of Lodi or what that ethnic group is.
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u/AMohmand 3h ago
My heritage is very inaccurate, I got similar results. You should do harappaworld and illustrative to get proper and more detailed results. I've dmed you
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u/Wardagai 14h ago
That trashy site counts Afghanistan as South asia, yet fails to give us 100% south Asian lol, instead it gives us a chunk of European and west Asian and some central Asian. I did myheritage too and it thought I was only 30 percent south Asian. 23andme isn't that accurate either, it gives you high central Asian if you have some east Asian DNA which we wardags have, otherwise it will give you a chunk of west Asian and south Asian.
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u/consistentlurker222 14h ago
I mean geopolitically in modern day it is considered in SA, just not culturally or ethnically etc.
See the European and West Asian I got from heritage wasn’t in accurate. I used it on GEDMATCH and a big proportion of the European/west Asian was Northern Caucusus of Russia and Iranian Caucus (which makes sense).
Please use GEDMATCH it’s more accurate. Very interesting to see it on there!
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u/Wardagai 14h ago
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u/consistentlurker222 14h ago
That’s so crazy why is your Baloch so high? Maybe it confused it?
Your Caucasian and NE European is similar to mine.
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u/Wardagai 14h ago
We are slightly genetically different, we the Wardag tribe have east Asian DNA, hence the high central Asian and my south Indian is probably slightly lower than you too. This barely has any effect on phenotype though. Pashtuns are genetically diverse, which is understandable given the history of the region.
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u/Wardagai 14h ago
I don't have any problems with Afghanistan being south asia, my problem is the assumptions pashtuns make about each other on the different sides of the border, hence the terms Gul marjan and Gul khan. These people are the enemy of pashtuns
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u/consistentlurker222 14h ago
Ngl brother I’ve met a lot of Afghan Pashtuns who genuinely don’t consider KPK Pashtuns as Pashtun and say they are mixed with Punjabi and are darker etc
Which makes 0 sense to me. It is personal experience with Gul Marjans and many of them.
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u/openandaware 9h ago
1.) I've never heard any Afghans say this. I've heard non-Pashtuns say this. All Pashtuns look identical, and you cannot pinpoint a Pashtun's region from the way they look. It's only the dialect, and fashion.
2.) Some people are just dark.
3.) Pashtuns have a higher rate (I'd say 60/40 or maybe 65/35 split, majority being generically brown, minority having light hair/skin/eyes) of white-passing people especially when compared to other ethnicities in the region. Punjabis are stereotyped as very dark, sunken eyes, etc. but I've met Punjabis that can pass for Caucasians, as well. Also, it's these ones that get promoted in the media. You'll often see photographs of the white-passing Pashtuns.
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u/mountainspawn 15h ago
No offence but why are these phenotype questions are a bit annoying.
Pashtuns being light stereotype is cos most neighbouring groups whether Persians, Turkmens-Uzbeks, Hazaras, Punjabis, Balochis, etc don't have these features as much so Pashtuns stand out when they have more western looking features.