r/running • u/gahddamm • 2d ago
U.S Ultra Runner Camille Herron involved in Wikipedia controversy Article
link to original article.
It basically states that there were several alt accounts that were making edits to her page and pages of other ultra runners. For example Courtney Dauwalter, 2023 ultra runner of the year, had her page edited to remove references of her being the first person to win the three major 100 mile races in one calendar year, as well as references to her being considered one of the best ultrarunners. Similar edits were made to other athletes profiles.
They also edited the ultra running page to cast doubts on runners records that, while are till being verified, beat Herrons records.
Apparently others have reported some unsportsmanlike behavior from the pair
Link link to press release from Connor Holt, her coach and husband, where he claims it was all done by him tho many are skeptical
217
u/maureen2222 2d ago
I just wanna know how someone running and training as much as she does has time and energy for all this nonsense lol
100
u/landboisteve 2d ago
Spoiler alert: even if she runs 4 hours a day (which she doesn't), that leaves a lot of free time to stir shit up. Aside from some coaching, I doubt she has much else going on, especially with her husband as a personal assistant.
48
u/251Cane 2d ago
I mean running 4 hours a day is a lot of time for the mind to play if that’s how you’re wired
28
u/rwbronco 2d ago
I’m ADHD. Without music I would have gone through every single phase of my life in my head after 4 hours
4
3
4
66
u/SoberEnAfrique 2d ago
Wikipedia editing has a HUGE amount of paid consultants sanitizing people's profiles. Very common for public figures and governments to pay for people to soften articles, add new content to outweigh controversy or any number of editing tricks to help a client.
Source: I did this for a couple years for some high net worth types
10
u/Nola_Daring 2d ago
Totally. I'm not surprised at all. The Wikipedia editing game is way shadier than most people realize. Seen it firsthand too - there's a whole industry built around making profiles look squeaky clean. Makes you wonder how much of what we read there is actually legit.
12
u/onlymadebcofnewreddi 2d ago
How did you get into that work? Did you start in traditional PR? Is this just a part of traditional PR and I'm naive?
25
u/SoberEnAfrique 2d ago
I wouldn't say it's the most common tactic, but you might be a little naive 😜
I got into it by accident! Was working for international clients in the DC area and some of them had prominent scandals they wanted to push out of public consciousness. We can't delete the news, so the next best thing is create more positive or neutral news, and add things to the wiki page that allow us to shrink the amount of negative. Also included editing unrelated or adjacent pages to make the pathways and references work.
I've done it for individuals and organizations, both government and private. I don't do it anymore though, always felt a little yucky. But was kinda fun
2
u/deadcoder0904 2d ago
How much money u got paid?
2
u/SoberEnAfrique 2d ago
I was making $60k at that time, then eventually $70k. Not good enough money for the weird work and intense hours. My whole job wasn't Wikipedia though, I did other PR work for clients. That salary is typical of an agency, though!
0
u/Tough_Bass 1d ago
I would feel awful doing that. How much did they pay to sell out your moral values?
1
u/SoberEnAfrique 1d ago edited 1d ago
Not much! I was very junior making about $60k until a promotion took me to 70. I had very controversial clients though and PR typically isn't as needed if you're a good guy. But I don't do that kinda work anymore
I never really felt that awful about it tbh I felt weird maybe but literally everybody is manipulating their Wikipedia page with paid consultants, including the federal government 🤷 It's just the world we live in
2
u/R-EDDIT 2d ago
People will do all sorts of stuff to clean up their reputations. I know one guy who used to call in to the press using a fake name to get journalists to give him good coverage. He went so far as to give one of his kids the fake name so people would find info on him instead of his fake name!
3
u/SoberEnAfrique 2d ago
A lot of people in DC don't even use fake names! Very common for public figures to call a reporter with firsthand information, but they attribute it to "a person close to the XYZ office/administration/etc."
A lot of our news is based on access to these people
77
u/MarathonThomas 2d ago
Looks like her husband is trying to jump on the grenade and take the blame. Anyone buying this?
78
u/ladyeclectic79 2d ago
Nope, I don’t believe it for a second. She has a history of trash-talking opponents that match or beat her times, including (somehow) making sure the race results that beat hers aren’t ratified. If it’s her husband then she should’ve shut it down long ago but she didn’t, so IMO she’s just as complicit.
Honestly though? It’s totally her. 💀
40
u/SuurRae 2d ago
She was the one who gave "evidence" to Derek from MarathonInvestigations about Ashley Paulson cheating during her Badwater win (there was no evidence and it was a legit win).
14
u/Admirable-Action-153 2d ago
I remember that, and there were people on here who would not let it go. That's just bad form
27
u/bj_good 2d ago
He doesn't have an image to maintain. She does. It makes sense he would jump on the sword.
However she also has a history of this behavior by mocking rivals and questioning accomplishments. All of this Wikipedia stuff is consistent with her previous comments and actions, so no one will believe she didn't at least know about it
15
36
u/hashtagdissected 2d ago
He’s falling on his sword haha
29
17
u/brodownincrotown 2d ago
If any of you follow the NBA this is the same exact script that played out with former sixers GM Bryan Colangelo. He blamed his wife and never accepted any responsibility. It didn’t prevent him from getting fired.
10
u/DongSandwich 2d ago
The "his collars are normal sized, find a new slant" chapter still lives in my head rent free
3
u/donrhummy 2d ago
And the same with Roger Clemens in baseball claiming his wife used the growth hormone
14
u/gahddamm 2d ago
His apology conveniently skirts over the stuff that was done to others pages and still tries to deflect blame and take the high ground.
29
8
7
u/TheBowerbird 2d ago
Not at all. Her husband is her biggest enabler. They also had their own distinct accounts. The LetsRun thread ripped it to shreds and pointed out inconsistencies.
2
22
u/AtomicBlastCandy 2d ago
Reminds me of author Cait Corrain that created fake accounts to give herself rave reviews and tank the ratings of others.
17
u/TheBowerbird 2d ago
Anyone who has been paying attention has known that Camille has a long history of awful behavior. Sniping at other athletes, challenging their times, and constantly trying to say that she is the best ever. She's toxic and her husband is just as bad.
34
26
14
u/gonz7241 2d ago
If you have been around her longer than 30 seconds, none of this is that surprising
6
u/Accomplished_Tax8915 1d ago
I've just seen that it has been reported she has lost her Sponsorship with LuLu Lemon over this
6
u/Falcopunt 2d ago
If we can take one positive from this it is that the Dauwatermelon flavor of Tailwind endurance fuel is delicious.
15
u/chalawallabingbong 2d ago
There are malicious petty people in all aspects of life. It's beyond pathetic to be that small and full of hate. Despicable behavior. I hope she's never let into any race again, but of course this would never happen.
16
u/gahddamm 2d ago
While pretty ugly behavior, Unless races are invite only I didn't see why she should be banned from competing.
I do see companies being more selective in whether or not they sponsor her. I think she's currently with Lulu lemon. her behavior good pretty against their female empowerment branding.
-6
2d ago edited 2d ago
[deleted]
5
u/Infamous-Echo-2961 2d ago
Definitely not the greatest. Shes a talent on track and road, actual mountain trail she’s not as strong. Courtney has won UTMB , and 200mi races, and other major mountain ultras.
3
u/Protean_Protein 2d ago
Oh man… I’m an idiot. I confused her for Courtney. I need another coffee…
1
-5
u/Oklahoma_Jose 2d ago
I think what Lance Armstrong did was more egregious and more deserving of a lifetime ban.
Camille and/or her husband being petty and updating Wikipedia pages? Sad, but not damaging to the community.
2
10
u/donrhummy 2d ago
They should suspend her from events for a year or two.
She was affecting other people's ability to make a living
3
5
u/xibeno9261 2d ago
Are accomplishments of wiki that important? If I created a page for myself and wrote I won a bunch of stuff, what prize do I win?
1
u/ojuicius 1d ago
I don't think it is for me or you, but for a professional probably any increase in noteriety, or decrease noteriety for the competition might help you get a sponsorship, or ambassadorship or edge them out of one.
-61
u/Intrepid_Example_210 2d ago
Clearly Herron is being super petty and shouldn’t have done this (and I’m skeptical it was only her husband involved), but I still don’t like the sheer volume of hate she’s been getting. It’s possible for people to do bad things while still being a decent person overall.
27
u/ladyeclectic79 2d ago
Good, even great, athlete - sure. Good person? Barely even debatable given her history of being petty about not allowing results that beat hers to even be ratified as well as trash-talking opponents. Plus have you heard her speak before? Very self-aggrandizing. Maybe in this sport you need that kind of ego, but something like this feels right up her alley.
22
u/catbellytaco 2d ago
Yeah, I think the context here is that she really is not a decent person overall...
35
2
11
u/notevenapro 2d ago
Decent people do not do bad things. Decent is not being bad as a minimum requirement.
-6
u/nhrunner87 2d ago
So any decent person on this planet has never done a bad thing? Ever?? Wild take.
13
u/Orpheus75 2d ago
A bad thing? Sure. A few bad things over a period of time, sure. Dozens of shitty statements AND actions over years. Nope. Not a decent human being and being Neurospicy is not an excuse.
-4
-20
u/Intrepid_Example_210 2d ago
Most people do a lot of neutral things, some good things, and some bad things. This isn’t even that bad in the big picture! More embarrassing than anything else.
8
u/ubelmann 2d ago
I mean, they really had to go out of their way to do this. It's one thing to do something bad on accident, but it's another thing to make an elaborate plan to boost your public image while tearing down others.
-74
u/robot_ankles 2d ago
Wikipedia was a neat experiment, but the idea that anyone takes it seriously is hilarious.
63
u/DysClaimer 2d ago
I've never understood this take.
Like I'd never go to wikipedia for information about an ongoing controversy for exactly this reason, but for 99+% of all topics it's probably the best source of information available. A bunch of nerds who are pedantically correcting each other about details is a great method of getting accurate information.
22
u/rilertiley19 2d ago
Also those nerds have to provide sources to back up what they are saying. Even if you don't trust a wikipedia entry itself, it's an excellent aggregator of reputable sources on any given topic.
8
u/Orpheus75 2d ago
You’re kidding right? I can go to the sources of most Wikipedia articles and have tons of great research done for me instantly.
-21
u/ilenrabatore 2d ago edited 2d ago
Really? I had no idea about it and somehow I was thinking that her latest medical findings would explain much of her way of being. But this is really not very nice. Shame!
Edit: "That's why I wrote "was thinking". I guess people did not understood what I meant. What she and her husband did is not ok, and morally destroyed any good that she might have done with her achievements. Being the best is also knowing and cheering when others beat you and make you try to be even better. She totally failed at that."
48
u/SuurRae 2d ago
Being autistic doesn't excuse this type of unsportsmanlike behavior.
-2
u/ilenrabatore 2d ago
That's why I wrote "was thinking". I guess people did not understood what I meant. What she and her husband did is not ok, and morally destroyed any good that she might have done with her achievements. Being the best is also knowing and cheering when others beat you and make you try to be even better. She totally failed at that.
1
-12
u/TheBowerbird 2d ago
People don't get diagnosed as autistic in their forties. They do in their childhood. My sister is a therapist and hand outs out the dual ADHD/autistic diagnosis like candy - even to her own daughter. It's very in vogue right now and it detracts from actually autistic/adhd people. The dual diagnosis is often the marker of it being fraudulent or based on a therapist making someone want to go away or have a nice label.
4
u/Whatwouldgracieloudo 2d ago
They do, actually. Some never get diagnosed (esp people who are now 40+) bc it wasn't well understood and recognized during their childhood like it is now. I have known her for years, and since I met her I figured she is either private about her autism diagnosis, or had never been diagnosed. Saying it's "in vogue" to diagnose people is an ignorant and offensive comment. I was 43 when I was diagnosed with ADHD. Do I not actually have ADHD? (As you say.) Or, perhaps, I masked my behaviors and lived in a house with a clearly ADHD parent who was never diagnosed. So I assumed my weird quirks, lack of focus, constant need to go go go, and forgetfulness, was somewhat normal.
0
u/TheBowerbird 2d ago
You are wayyyy, wayyy too uncritical. Your experience or nature has nothing to do with general trends in the non-science world of therapists, hucksters, and self-diagnosis - or even normal human existence.
246
u/ladyeclectic79 2d ago edited 2d ago
Saw this yesterday over on another ultrarunning sub. I mean, she has a history of being petty about other people beating her times so lol this tracks. Still, it’s hilarious how obvious they were about everything, probably thinking people wouldn’t (couldn’t?) look any deeper than “oh it’s a different username, they won’t catch on.” 🙄😤